Friday, February 20, 2009
GS kettlebelling First Impressions
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If you've touched a kettlebell, you may be aware that there are a few approaches to KB practice. One has come to be known as "hard style" taught by Pavel Tsatsouline, and certified RKC's (like myself). The RKC approach also refers to itself as a "school of strength." It's this approach i've been using in the Perfect Rep Quest.
The other style is usually called GS (for Girevoy Sport) or Kettlebell Sport.
The main difference between the two styles seems to be technique and goal. In Hard Style, with its focus on strength, there is a consequent focus on generating tension for power and strength. The technique is to generate tension to move a heavy object a few times. Alternately, the GS approach seems to be (i stress seems as i am new to this GS country) to focus on endurance for performance over time. This is not to say that strength is not a part of it - men compete with shoving 2, 32kg bells up and down in the clean and jerk for numbers in time. But the sport is really to see how many times that weight bell can get pumped in that move in that time.
So the technique to manage this is about optimizing efficiency rather than tension - endurance strength rather than power strength. In this respect the style of the key moves is different to support these distinct goals.
This weekend, i had the opportunity to learn GS style from Steve Cotter under the auspices of the new IKFF CKT certification hosted by Simple Strength's Rannoch Donald, and using the newly demo'd London Kettlebells competition bells with most welcome highly indestructible paint job.
The main thing i take away from this right now that it's another way to think about applying these oh so versatile fitness tools. Pacing is a nice idea. Going for time is the way i was trained in x-country running: forget about speed at first and go for time. That means taking as much recovery *within* a set as needed to complete the set. Recovery is not doing nothing: it's active. In an overhead squat cycle, the rest may be at the bottom of the squat with the bell still locked out on top, or it may be while standing. In the jerk, it may be bell up top or bell in the rack. So you're holding/balancing/maintaining weight, but it's not in motion. You haven't put it down is the thing.
The practice of someone watching the clock for you gets to be a little meditative. Focus without boredom. "1 minute - great"...."2minutes...."
IT's very much a different head space than the more GRRR of hard style.
I've heard some argue on various fora that the GS approach is superior for health and well being and longevity. Ok. Show me the research that says this is so. That shows for instance long distance runners are healthier into old age than power lifters. It's not clear to me why we'd need to get into a this style is better than that style. I would be very keen though to see real data about how/why these different approaches may favour different types of health issues.
Without that evidence, well we're just whistling dixie.
In the interim of such claims being certified, it is clearly established that GS is a sport in a way that hard style is not (this point is not in contention, i think :)). As such, for hardstylers too it may be fun to think about translating that hard style grr attitude into a competitive realm. Double 32 C&J'ing for time/numbers, gentlemen? For women, i learned that in the US, it's snatching, jerking or "long cycle" clean and jerking with one arm, and a 16. Though it seems gals use 24's in Russia. Nothing wimpy about that.
Indeed, part of the rationale for going long (in time) with these weights is that really, how big a deal is it to press a big ol' kettlebell once next to a powerlift with a barbell? Ok, put that way, ya a single kettlebell lift ain't that big, relatively speaking (pressing a 24 is still a big deal to me, OK? but i get the point). So what else can you do with a "lighter" weight? Er, press it again? and again?
So to aid the Sport aspect of this repetition approach to kb's, like olympic bars and plates, they're all a standard size. Many folks have spoken about the rationale for this standardization: the only thing that changes is the weight. There's something appealing about working the groove of a move with the same shape, whether an 8 or a 28. It is interesting to train and groove with one weight, and go up to the next with exactly the same form. It's cool.
The form initially seems a little freaky - bending back and curling over the bell, resting on the hip etc. Hence the benefit of proper instruction to learn how to do this without herniating a disk.
BJ Bliffert, RKC, told me about GS over the summer - and that if you're thinking about it, start lighter than you're used to working with in RKC style. From my brief experience to date, he's right. Because of the time element, greasing the groove, getting the form is a big deal - it's a whole new muscle pattern to learn and become efficient with. And brain theory would say it's also a whole new bunch of neural maps to put down. So as always with the perfect rep, looks like high volume low(er) weight is the way to go.
Right now i'm not sure exactly where the GS approach will fit into my training practice life, but i do really like the idea of timed sets as a component of that. Cotter talks about these as a mental discispline practice, not only a physical discipline to stay in there. Getting the mix of weight to time is then important - and is certainly where i was at with the timed sets we did on the weekend: balancing challenge of effort with tenacity of focus to keep going wihtout burning out. It was enjoyable in a rough kinda way.
Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi talks about this as flow: being in the space of something that is sufficiently challenging to keep you engaged, but not pushing you beyond your skills; using them without overloading them and so going into stress/startle mode. This is not to say that GS has a lock on flow with kettlebells - just that you're likely to find it there if you have the time to learn the technique and the opportunity to connect with someone who can teach you - so you do get the tech- nique, and do hit the flow. Right now the practice - learning the skill is part of a flow, too.
Right now, it seems like the IKFF is reaching out to as many continents as it can find, and there are a growing host of IKFF certified CKT'ers (also like me) out there. That said, i'm gonna be practicing the form a whole lot more for the time being to get it. I got the sense there was way more technique happening than we were explicitly taught. so for the nonce, i'm just working the sweep, the repose, the sweep, the repose, checking my grip checking the handle in the hand and again.
Initial impression? i don't know martial arts, but i hear that most martial arts types learn many styles. In a similar vein, i'm really glad to have had the opportunity to learn a new style, and now have the opportunity to think about how to take this new learning into my own physical practice.
(thanks to ken blackburn for the source image) Tweet Follow @begin2dig
If you've touched a kettlebell, you may be aware that there are a few approaches to KB practice. One has come to be known as "hard style" taught by Pavel Tsatsouline, and certified RKC's (like myself). The RKC approach also refers to itself as a "school of strength." It's this approach i've been using in the Perfect Rep Quest.The other style is usually called GS (for Girevoy Sport) or Kettlebell Sport.
The main difference between the two styles seems to be technique and goal. In Hard Style, with its focus on strength, there is a consequent focus on generating tension for power and strength. The technique is to generate tension to move a heavy object a few times. Alternately, the GS approach seems to be (i stress seems as i am new to this GS country) to focus on endurance for performance over time. This is not to say that strength is not a part of it - men compete with shoving 2, 32kg bells up and down in the clean and jerk for numbers in time. But the sport is really to see how many times that weight bell can get pumped in that move in that time.
So the technique to manage this is about optimizing efficiency rather than tension - endurance strength rather than power strength. In this respect the style of the key moves is different to support these distinct goals.
This weekend, i had the opportunity to learn GS style from Steve Cotter under the auspices of the new IKFF CKT certification hosted by Simple Strength's Rannoch Donald, and using the newly demo'd London Kettlebells competition bells with most welcome highly indestructible paint job.
The main thing i take away from this right now that it's another way to think about applying these oh so versatile fitness tools. Pacing is a nice idea. Going for time is the way i was trained in x-country running: forget about speed at first and go for time. That means taking as much recovery *within* a set as needed to complete the set. Recovery is not doing nothing: it's active. In an overhead squat cycle, the rest may be at the bottom of the squat with the bell still locked out on top, or it may be while standing. In the jerk, it may be bell up top or bell in the rack. So you're holding/balancing/maintaining weight, but it's not in motion. You haven't put it down is the thing.
The practice of someone watching the clock for you gets to be a little meditative. Focus without boredom. "1 minute - great"...."2minutes...."
IT's very much a different head space than the more GRRR of hard style.
I've heard some argue on various fora that the GS approach is superior for health and well being and longevity. Ok. Show me the research that says this is so. That shows for instance long distance runners are healthier into old age than power lifters. It's not clear to me why we'd need to get into a this style is better than that style. I would be very keen though to see real data about how/why these different approaches may favour different types of health issues.
Without that evidence, well we're just whistling dixie.
In the interim of such claims being certified, it is clearly established that GS is a sport in a way that hard style is not (this point is not in contention, i think :)). As such, for hardstylers too it may be fun to think about translating that hard style grr attitude into a competitive realm. Double 32 C&J'ing for time/numbers, gentlemen? For women, i learned that in the US, it's snatching, jerking or "long cycle" clean and jerking with one arm, and a 16. Though it seems gals use 24's in Russia. Nothing wimpy about that.
Indeed, part of the rationale for going long (in time) with these weights is that really, how big a deal is it to press a big ol' kettlebell once next to a powerlift with a barbell? Ok, put that way, ya a single kettlebell lift ain't that big, relatively speaking (pressing a 24 is still a big deal to me, OK? but i get the point). So what else can you do with a "lighter" weight? Er, press it again? and again?
So to aid the Sport aspect of this repetition approach to kb's, like olympic bars and plates, they're all a standard size. Many folks have spoken about the rationale for this standardization: the only thing that changes is the weight. There's something appealing about working the groove of a move with the same shape, whether an 8 or a 28. It is interesting to train and groove with one weight, and go up to the next with exactly the same form. It's cool.
The form initially seems a little freaky - bending back and curling over the bell, resting on the hip etc. Hence the benefit of proper instruction to learn how to do this without herniating a disk.
BJ Bliffert, RKC, told me about GS over the summer - and that if you're thinking about it, start lighter than you're used to working with in RKC style. From my brief experience to date, he's right. Because of the time element, greasing the groove, getting the form is a big deal - it's a whole new muscle pattern to learn and become efficient with. And brain theory would say it's also a whole new bunch of neural maps to put down. So as always with the perfect rep, looks like high volume low(er) weight is the way to go.
Right now i'm not sure exactly where the GS approach will fit into my training practice life, but i do really like the idea of timed sets as a component of that. Cotter talks about these as a mental discispline practice, not only a physical discipline to stay in there. Getting the mix of weight to time is then important - and is certainly where i was at with the timed sets we did on the weekend: balancing challenge of effort with tenacity of focus to keep going wihtout burning out. It was enjoyable in a rough kinda way.
Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi talks about this as flow: being in the space of something that is sufficiently challenging to keep you engaged, but not pushing you beyond your skills; using them without overloading them and so going into stress/startle mode. This is not to say that GS has a lock on flow with kettlebells - just that you're likely to find it there if you have the time to learn the technique and the opportunity to connect with someone who can teach you - so you do get the tech- nique, and do hit the flow. Right now the practice - learning the skill is part of a flow, too.
Right now, it seems like the IKFF is reaching out to as many continents as it can find, and there are a growing host of IKFF certified CKT'ers (also like me) out there. That said, i'm gonna be practicing the form a whole lot more for the time being to get it. I got the sense there was way more technique happening than we were explicitly taught. so for the nonce, i'm just working the sweep, the repose, the sweep, the repose, checking my grip checking the handle in the hand and again.
Initial impression? i don't know martial arts, but i hear that most martial arts types learn many styles. In a similar vein, i'm really glad to have had the opportunity to learn a new style, and now have the opportunity to think about how to take this new learning into my own physical practice.
(thanks to ken blackburn for the source image) Tweet Follow @begin2dig
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Tuesday, February 10, 2009
i just C&P'd the 20!
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ok, so not a deep post this; just personal celebration.
i just clean & pressed the 20k on the right side. first time. a bit of hip to get through the sticking point but not a ton, and the thing is it went up otherwise unassisted.
This is a big deal personally - had almost thought it wasn't gonna happen. Gives me hope that the 24 is not quite as far out of site as i'd thought it might be.
y'all go get your PR's too!
happy dance time
-later: the 20 on the right feels a bit right now like the 16 did on the left before i got the clean figured out: planets must align, everything be just so to get it; it's not consistent.
But the interesting thing to me, is that this time i *know* - or am at least pretty certain - that it's a technique issue now rather than a strength issue. So perhaps the same approach that worked for the 16L will work with the 20R, eh? to get that dialed in. (for those who haven't been following this, it's all part of the "perfect rep quest series")
Never imagined strength would be so rich a skill/experience.
mc
update: Feb 28, 2009
second 20k single - less hip and faster going up this time.
will miracles never cease!
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i just clean & pressed the 20k on the right side. first time. a bit of hip to get through the sticking point but not a ton, and the thing is it went up otherwise unassisted.
This is a big deal personally - had almost thought it wasn't gonna happen. Gives me hope that the 24 is not quite as far out of site as i'd thought it might be.
y'all go get your PR's too!
happy dance time
-later: the 20 on the right feels a bit right now like the 16 did on the left before i got the clean figured out: planets must align, everything be just so to get it; it's not consistent.
But the interesting thing to me, is that this time i *know* - or am at least pretty certain - that it's a technique issue now rather than a strength issue. So perhaps the same approach that worked for the 16L will work with the 20R, eh? to get that dialed in. (for those who haven't been following this, it's all part of the "perfect rep quest series")
Never imagined strength would be so rich a skill/experience.
mc
update: Feb 28, 2009
second 20k single - less hip and faster going up this time.
will miracles never cease!
update: Thurs. March 26
third C&P in dressing gown after breakie
update Friday March 27
fourth C&P in dressing gown after breakie.
hmm, a pattern?
have tried on other occasions before and since (like today March 27 - no go). Technique? New Moon? what??
update easter monday April 13:
recovering from a vicious cold, jet lagged, back from two weeks away and zero 20k attempts (no such thing available), popped it up once after breakie and ONCE AGAIN after lunch. no warm up no nothin' just up and then up.
that's 6 C&P's and the first double in one day.
i was gonna try for a third, but wanted to have a 100% success day.
May 2...
i haven't written down each c&p since the above - there haven't been that many :). Maybe one or two a week. and not on the same days.
But today, after a 5 min RKC snatch test prep (98 - personal record, and honestly was not killing myself, this is not the TSC; even saying that, there's a long way to go to double that for a GS event) - yes AFTER that, i did 5 C&P singles. Pauses between them: doing z health shoulder work. But there they were. Later that evening i snuck in one more. It wasn't until i went for the 7th that that was it.
What changed?
May 3...
after a vo2max row (rowing is very similar to snatching), i had a miss with the C&P - that usually spells zero for the day, but went back after recovery; did 1 C&P followed by a second complete press. hmm.
One thing that has changed - besides i'd hope the natural process of muscular adaptation: attitude. In keeping with what i've been learning in the Sedona Method about effortless this that and the other thing, i thought i'd try effortless pressing. That doesn't mean not tensing muscles as needed etc, but it's i dunno, perhaps a state of mind that lets the work happen without getting all fussed or psyched or something about it.
I don't know what to say other than, the day i approached the C&P of the 20 with that attitude is the day i got 6 singles, and the next day got 2 presses non-stop. Maybe it's just coincidence that on that same day the muscular strength was just there. but we'll see. this is something i plan to test in going for the 24.
it's a drag to need to wait a few days before doing heavy pressing again... drat that recovery.
May 31 - post RKC Denmark 09 assisting, post zhealth I phase.
Pavel gave me some hip flexor advice at the Cert to drive the clean more to awesome effect, and Eric Cobb gave me some great stance and eye work to get through the sticking point, with an eye towards the 24. Result: get home and I'm up to 9 C&P singles with the 20. We'll see when that 24 comes down (which means goes up, of course).
update easter monday April 13:
recovering from a vicious cold, jet lagged, back from two weeks away and zero 20k attempts (no such thing available), popped it up once after breakie and ONCE AGAIN after lunch. no warm up no nothin' just up and then up.
that's 6 C&P's and the first double in one day.
i was gonna try for a third, but wanted to have a 100% success day.
May 2...
i haven't written down each c&p since the above - there haven't been that many :). Maybe one or two a week. and not on the same days.
But today, after a 5 min RKC snatch test prep (98 - personal record, and honestly was not killing myself, this is not the TSC; even saying that, there's a long way to go to double that for a GS event) - yes AFTER that, i did 5 C&P singles. Pauses between them: doing z health shoulder work. But there they were. Later that evening i snuck in one more. It wasn't until i went for the 7th that that was it.
What changed?
May 3...
after a vo2max row (rowing is very similar to snatching), i had a miss with the C&P - that usually spells zero for the day, but went back after recovery; did 1 C&P followed by a second complete press. hmm.
One thing that has changed - besides i'd hope the natural process of muscular adaptation: attitude. In keeping with what i've been learning in the Sedona Method about effortless this that and the other thing, i thought i'd try effortless pressing. That doesn't mean not tensing muscles as needed etc, but it's i dunno, perhaps a state of mind that lets the work happen without getting all fussed or psyched or something about it.
I don't know what to say other than, the day i approached the C&P of the 20 with that attitude is the day i got 6 singles, and the next day got 2 presses non-stop. Maybe it's just coincidence that on that same day the muscular strength was just there. but we'll see. this is something i plan to test in going for the 24.it's a drag to need to wait a few days before doing heavy pressing again... drat that recovery.
May 31 - post RKC Denmark 09 assisting, post zhealth I phase.
Pavel gave me some hip flexor advice at the Cert to drive the clean more to awesome effect, and Eric Cobb gave me some great stance and eye work to get through the sticking point, with an eye towards the 24. Result: get home and I'm up to 9 C&P singles with the 20. We'll see when that 24 comes down (which means goes up, of course).
Sunday, February 8, 2009
Weighted Pistol Puzzle
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I own i have been frustrated by the weighted pistol. My body weight pistol is not a car wreck. On a good day, can even do that lovely hold your toe with leg outstetched while going up and down. But the weighted version - any kind of weight - is a challenge i canna crack. I wonder if part of this is the way a woman's center of mass is different from a guy's?
Anyway, i've finally been places where i can set up a rig to give adam glass's advice a go:
If you're just looking to get your body weight pistol happening, there are two sources: the best freebie is at Beast Skills. (i think the person's first name is Jim, but it's actually really challenging to find his name on his site!)
The best book/video on building appropriate strength/tension techniques, also featuring how to get a one arm push up, is Pavel Tsatsouline's Naked Warrior.
If you've had trouble with weighted pistols, and have found techniques to break the cycle and get success, please share.
I'll let you know how the sling shot technique progresses.
Feb 25: update here and prelim review of Steve Cotter's mastering the pistol Tweet Follow @begin2dig
Anyway, i've finally been places where i can set up a rig to give adam glass's advice a go:
- hang a band from something (adam suggests within a power rack/cage) to be able, effectively, to put one's butt in a sling to help with that get up from the ground sticking point.
If you're just looking to get your body weight pistol happening, there are two sources: the best freebie is at Beast Skills. (i think the person's first name is Jim, but it's actually really challenging to find his name on his site!)The best book/video on building appropriate strength/tension techniques, also featuring how to get a one arm push up, is Pavel Tsatsouline's Naked Warrior.
If you've had trouble with weighted pistols, and have found techniques to break the cycle and get success, please share.
I'll let you know how the sling shot technique progresses.
Feb 25: update here and prelim review of Steve Cotter's mastering the pistol Tweet Follow @begin2dig
Friday, February 6, 2009
quick update
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Hi folks,
just a quick update to say i've been on the road for over the past fortnight, just catching up. I'm sorry for no new posts in that period, and appreciate your patience.
Coming up in the next week or so:
bone mineral density and thoughts on enhancing it (for adam), how bands might bust plateaus, and vitamin d: how do you get enough? what is enough? no really.
see y'all soon.
mc - back where the UK seems to feel the ice age was too long ago to remember how to shovel. i sense there'll be ample time this millennium to rekindle those skills. Tweet Follow @begin2dig
just a quick update to say i've been on the road for over the past fortnight, just catching up. I'm sorry for no new posts in that period, and appreciate your patience.
Coming up in the next week or so:
bone mineral density and thoughts on enhancing it (for adam), how bands might bust plateaus, and vitamin d: how do you get enough? what is enough? no really.
see y'all soon.
mc - back where the UK seems to feel the ice age was too long ago to remember how to shovel. i sense there'll be ample time this millennium to rekindle those skills. Tweet Follow @begin2dig
Wednesday, January 28, 2009
Summary of Perfect Rep Quest so far - article listing
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Over the past couple months i've been exploring the concept of the Perfect Rep that can be developed from both high and low volume cycles, as presented by Kenneth Jay's beast protocol, when combined with Time and 5rep of 10RM sets, as presented by Charles Staley in EDT.
The quest is not over, but there are enough posts getting potentially lost in blog world that i thought it might be useful to have one post that just references them all to date. Likewise, i've posted the links as a sidebar on the blog, too, just for the time being.
Thank you to those folks who have written to say they've found this series useful, and hope those coming to it for the first time may find something of use for your own program.
Let me know.
Coda
The quest is not over, but there are enough posts getting potentially lost in blog world that i thought it might be useful to have one post that just references them all to date. Likewise, i've posted the links as a sidebar on the blog, too, just for the time being.
That's the series so far. What's compelling to me is not just the strength gains but what a difference a wee month of focused attention on one move can bring. This is working this move only twice a week, but with progress i would not have thought possible even with focussed practice.
2008-11-21 Exploring the Perfect Rep: the Kettlebell Front Squat Revisisted.
This article takes a look at small adjustments in movement that have big effects - like head position in the front squat and the effect of the arthrokinetic reflex on strength.
2008-12-01 The Perfect Rep and the Role of Volume with Form
Why i got interested in Kenneth Jay's Beast Pressing protocol for improving pressing strength: what is high volume (lower weight) supposed to do for improving strength? How does the quantity of reps contribute to learning patterns? and how does this connect to strength?
2008-12-05 Perfect Rep Quest: Volume + Integrated Cardio
A quick reflection on using high cardio reps between these high volume sets to help support strength - based on research around "integrated cardio"
2008-12-14 Strength and the Perfect Rep: Volume Works
Six fold increase in heavy presses between two sessions of heavy volume work.
2008-12-15 mc's Version of KJ's Beast Pressing Protocol
Some folks wanted to know more clearly the aspects of my adaptation of Kenneth's beast pressing protocol. Basically, it's adding some EDT elements. Works for me, but i make no claims yet (a sample of one person being rather small) that this is an optimal approach. It works for me though.
2008-12-21 Perfect Rep & Insane Improvement from Breathing?
500% improvement on the heavy day from the last session? from breathing?
2008-12-31 The Perfect Rep, the Kettlebell Clean and 10 thousand Hours
This one is a longer piece about how all the above sessions came together to help fix my weaker side's clean to get the press. The problem: i could do many singles but zip series on that side. It seems the foundation laid in just over a month of high volume/low volume provided sufficient basis to unpack the clean issue and get it working to enable sequential C&P'ing. Practice really does make a difference. That seems so obvious, as i suppose the best solutions do, but the reasons why practice works seem more nuanced than anticipated.
Thank you to those folks who have written to say they've found this series useful, and hope those coming to it for the first time may find something of use for your own program.
Let me know.
Coda
2009-02-10 I just C&P'd the 20Tweet Follow @begin2dig
This is a celebration of sorts that yes, this stuff all really does work. This post has been regularly updated with experience with the 20. That's a touch more than a 1/3 my bodyweight, so i'm happy. 24 is in my sights.
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